Ever wonder why we are instinctively drawn to the forbidden, or how exaggerated stories can lead us down the wrong path? Join us as we reflect on these questions in our milestone 20th episode. We kick off the episode with a light-hearted discussion about our NFL team rivalry and our growing Twitter community @findingfaithpod, but things quickly take a deep dive as we explore the timeless stories and lessons from the Garden of Eden.
We grapple with the intriguing concept of heaven and earth, the repercussions of the serpent’s temptation, and the pivotal role of Jesus as the sacrificial lamb. Moving forward, we draw inspiration from the trials of Cain and Abel to discuss the origins of morals and the profound perfection of life's inner workings. In the face of trials, we consider the enduring power of love and the strength we can draw from our faith.
We conclude the episode by tackling the challenge of breaking old habits and the importance of practicing righteousness. We share our personal experiences and insights on how making changes in our behavior can bring about positive outcomes in our lives. Inspired by the story of Cain and Abel, we caution against the destructive power of bitterness and jealousy. As always, we are eager to hear your thoughts, so don't hesitate to reach out to us through our email or Twitter handle. We look forward to continuing our journey of finding faith (and hopefully not losing too much sleep) together.
Email: findingfaith.losingsleep@gmail.com
Twitter: @FindingFaithPod
Ever wonder why we are instinctively drawn to the forbidden, or how exaggerated stories can lead us down the wrong path? Join us as we reflect on these questions in our milestone 20th episode. We kick off the episode with a light-hearted discussion about our NFL team rivalry and our growing Twitter community @findingfaithpod, but things quickly take a deep dive as we explore the timeless stories and lessons from the Garden of Eden.
We grapple with the intriguing concept of heaven and earth, the repercussions of the serpent’s temptation, and the pivotal role of Jesus as the sacrificial lamb. Moving forward, we draw inspiration from the trials of Cain and Abel to discuss the origins of morals and the profound perfection of life's inner workings. In the face of trials, we consider the enduring power of love and the strength we can draw from our faith.
We conclude the episode by tackling the challenge of breaking old habits and the importance of practicing righteousness. We share our personal experiences and insights on how making changes in our behavior can bring about positive outcomes in our lives. Inspired by the story of Cain and Abel, we caution against the destructive power of bitterness and jealousy. As always, we are eager to hear your thoughts, so don't hesitate to reach out to us through our email or Twitter handle. We look forward to continuing our journey of finding faith (and hopefully not losing too much sleep) together.
Email: findingfaith.losingsleep@gmail.com
Twitter: @FindingFaithPod
It's time to wake up and find faith in losing sleep. Podcast episode 20 20 happy anniversary here in Michele. That's our 20th episode anniversary. It's awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, pretty crazy thing about actually I knew we're at 20, but it didn't really really hit me that we're at 20. Yeah, that's 20. Two oh two, oh hey, that is Pierre and Michele. They are a married couple on the finding faith and losing sleep. They don't just play it on the finding faith and losing sleep. I'd be in trouble all the time. Okay, that's what it is. I am Wes, easily one of your hosts at low for dinner on Twitter. Pierre is at P we 31 and Michelle, I've heard the bad news that you actually are no longer on Twitter, so I don't have to give out your Twitter handle anymore. That's kind of like a little blessing. This week is what it is.
Speaker 2:Very funny, wes, you're still on Twitter. What you don't want to say it this week? I don't know why. Why would that be?
Speaker 1:Michelle and I are friends for a long time now and one of the kind of frenemies actually, because her team is the Green Bay Packers and my team is the Chicago Bears. This is week one of the NFL season and of course our bears, my bears and her Packers are playing each other. So I just give her a little hard time because I am in the driver's seat of the finding faith and losing sleep podcast. She is at go pack, go for one one over on Twitter and Pierre, I don't, I can never remember the Twitter handle for the for the podcast.
Speaker 3:It's at finding faith pod. So just at finding faith pod. Pretty simple, honestly, but it's okay.
Speaker 2:He's bears and cut him some slack.
Speaker 1:And we actually have a lot of followers. I checked it out and I was like, wow, how in the world do we have that many followers? I don't, I don't, okay, but I, you know, I have finding faith. Pod is what it is, and then the email where people can call and complain, or email and complain. They can't call. The email address, of course, about the podcast is what.
Speaker 3:It's a finding faith dot losing sleep. At gmailcom and you actually had one said long time listener, but it was addressed to you so I'm not sure how long time they were looking to be a guest on the podcast, so I hadn't I hadn't replied yet, so I will reply, but I thought I'd bring that up at the email was addressed to West specifically as a long time listener. I was like you can't be that long time If you don't know that I'm the one.
Speaker 1:That means that you know, well, you know, we are on our 20th podcast anniversary, so that's good.
Speaker 3:They want to be on our podcast, or they want you to be on their podcast or they have a sound like they have a client that wants to be on our podcast.
Speaker 1:Oh, my, that's that's we have to. That may be a little sketchy, I don't. I don't know how to handle that. That sounds interesting. We may have to pursue that, peers, what we may have to do. By the way, if you get a chance to leave a review or leave a comment or anything like that, give, give some ratings, please do just.
Speaker 1:It helps beat the aggl rhythms and we try to get the show out there to other people, because we are just normal, average, everyday people trying to work our way through life, different situations, different circumstances. If you have been with us for a long time like a long time listener, then then you have come to realize that we do talk about some controversial topics and it's cool to talk about those things, especially with people from different backgrounds, like all three of us have, and still agree to disagree, maybe sometimes still just be able to have a good friendship, a good brotherly and sisterly love for one another. Throughout all these different things that we're going through in life, having different opinions from different backgrounds, and still being able to get along. I think that's important to be able to do and that's what that's what this whole podcast is made up for.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I need. I need people to email peers so that I can start sending stuff anonymously.
Speaker 1:Oh, how does that work? I don't know.
Speaker 3:I don't know either. But yeah, it's good, especially today's society, to be able to agree, to disagree, and I know it gets tough for us. You know, if you got any type of opinion on something that differs, you know you're just be little or told your own or stupid or whatever. And you know we all three of us have different opinions on different topics and it's cool that we can disagree and talk through it and then come back, you know, later and still be free.
Speaker 1:And I totally have been belittled and felt stupid. After all my years in this life, I've felt that way. So it's okay, I'm cool. I'm cool with doing that. That's fine with me. But hey, I do want to thank people too. We've received at least one or two questions, if I'm not mistaken, either throughout leaving a comment on whatever listening platform you like to listen to it on, or through the email, and I have been trying to get a question episode right Instead of doing like we normally do working our way through the Bible or working our way through life, however it is. I want a question episode, but we're going to need more than one or two or three questions, however many we have. I want more than that. So, finding faith, losing sleep at gmailcom Is that right?
Speaker 3:Finding faithlosingsleep at gmailcom. So halfway there you forgot the period in the middle.
Speaker 1:I forget exclamation points and commas too. We are in Genesis, chapter three, guys, and we done this episode before. I feel like, didn't we do this like in a past episode?
Speaker 3:Yeah, we went, we went one, two and we bled into three, because that's when I kind of had my theory on the whole Lucifer being in the garden situation.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, yeah, you really went low. If you went back a couple of episodes and listened to that, pierre, I didn't know you thought that far outside the box, pierre.
Speaker 3:I can't. I told you like this is a losing sleep is the last part of this podcast, so there's things that I think about that keep me awake and I go down a bunch of rabbit holes. I like to, I want to know. Even though there's certain things I know we can't know and we'll never know, there's still doesn't stop me from pursuing some, some more knowledge on certain situations.
Speaker 1:Michelle, I think that that's something, as I studied for this and prayed about this episode different things like that. It's one of the things that you know, I want to have answers to, because there's there's a lot of questions that pop up in Genesis, chapter three. The number one question that comes up for me how in the world was Satan a snake? You know, did the snake really talk? Did those kind of questions just make me go well, and it's hard to understand and fathom that something like that could happen, and so that's where you got to have a little faith, but you also don't necessarily have to have all the answers.
Speaker 2:I think that's true.
Speaker 2:I mean, I actually appreciate the fact that Pierre goes down these rabbit holes because it's kind of in my nature to do the same thing, but he kind of does it for me. So it and having honestly having this podcast, like those things help, I think, our marriage. Because if you, if you know us or if you have listened long enough, you might be surprised if you're only a listener and don't actually know us. But Pierre is actually kind of a man, a few words. So it's been good for me to hear sometimes what he thinks about things and and how he feels about things other than when he goes down these rabbit holes. But you know, I think I guess I don't know, like it's you're right, wes it's hard because we don't know right and we're. I think we're all just thirsting for that knowledge, which is why this is so important for us to be able to talk through these things, cause I know we're not the only ones and you know Pierre usually has better insight than I do, but I'll, I'll grant him that I don't.
Speaker 1:I don't know that I necessarily conclude I did a lot of study, I did a lot of background, I've had a lot of experience in studying these things and I've thought about this Genesis chapter three for a long time and I hate to break the news to everybody, but I don't have any, you know, groundbreaking revelations on the answer to some of those questions about Genesis chapter three.
Speaker 1:I'm going to lead us around to different Bible things and talk about some different Bible things to try and comfort us, so we don't lose too much sleep over it. But I will encourage you if you think that you have the answers to some of these questions, you can get in touch with us through all those different avenues like we talked about earlier, and please do, because we want answers too, and and the reason why we put ourselves out there is to tell you that we don't have all the answers and sometimes we have more questions than answers. But as a believer, or even as a person, that's okay. It's okay to have questions and it's okay to try and think about these things and to try to rational and to talk about them with other people. It's okay. I don't think that it should be a discouraging thing, pierre.
Speaker 3:For sure, like you want to be able to have these conversations, like it doesn't help to always just let things be or just leave them on the back burner. If things are bothering you or concerning you, even if you don't get the answers you're looking for, it's often good to talk through things. I mean, that's why people go through like therapists and therapy and psychologists and those type of situations, because sometimes a relief is simply getting something off your chest and just being able to speak it out and have someone to listen. You know, and I think we're in a world right now there's there's a lot of talkers, there's a lot of people that want to talk. Are there enough listeners that will truly just be be willing to sit down and, you know, just hear what hear people out, hear what they have to say, without basically listening to reply, just listen to listen, and I think it's something that we all struggle with at some point.
Speaker 1:You know, it makes me mad is when people tell me that they you bring up. Let's just say, I bring up religion to somebody, because the day ends in a Y and so I'm going to bring up religion to somebody, that's just how it's going to be. And they tell me, oh no, no, no, I don't talk about religion with people and I just. It makes me mad, I don't you bring up politics, I don't talk about politics. And I sit there and I think, well, how's the world ever gonna become a better place if we can't talk about politics and religion amongst each other or with each other, because those are two very important things that, honestly, when done right, makes the world a better place. You know, I mean just it can make the world a better place. Through government, through politics, you can make the world a better place. Through religion, you can make the world a better place.
Speaker 1:Yes, when both sides are abused, when either thing is abused, it makes the world maybe a worse place, especially for individuals that get abused by the systems. All right, it does, but you can never improve on a broken system if you can't talk about it, and you can't ever I don't wanna say expose broken systems if you don't ever talk about it. But it just frustrates me because I think people need to get that stuff out and open. And one of the reasons why they don't wanna talk about it is either because they've ignored it, because they're so frustrated with the systems whether it's a government or whether it's a religion they're so frustrated with it that they just ignore it, so they don't think they know enough about it, so they don't wanna talk about it or they've been hurt in the past by something and they don't wanna rehash those kind of things. And I can understand some of that stuff okay, I do. But if we don't ever talk about it, how in the world are we gonna ever make any of it any better?
Speaker 2:Well, I think some of that West might be that people are afraid that their words will be twisted and the intent behind them then turns into something different because somebody misunderstood or misrepresented what they said or how they felt and it just becomes this big argument or something that gets out of control. That really didn't need to happen. And so I think a lot of times people just err on the side of not having the conversation versus having to then go back, reiterate and justify and defend what they've said or how they feel, and I think it's sad. I think you're right that it is important to have those conversations and to find some common ground, and if you can't find the common ground to be able to agree, to disagree, like we talked.
Speaker 1:I wish I would have thought about that, pierre, before we decided to do the podcast that our words could be twisted and manipulated and turned all the way around. I used to kiss us, I wish, hey, speaking about arguments. So here we have the Fall man, right In Genesis, chapter three. The serpent, it says, was more of the crafty than any other beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said to the woman how do I do a serpent's voice? I've done God's voice and I felt kind of strange about that. The serpent's voice in a snake. I don't. I kind of, yeah, how do you do that?
Speaker 2:You had to do the little on the end of your s's.
Speaker 1:I'm not surprised a Green Bay Packer fan can do a good snake in the grass voice. No, no, yeah I do. I picture the snake in what's with Jungle Book, the Jungle Book. No, yeah, I'm not gonna do the voice though. He said to the woman.
Speaker 1:Indeed, god said you shall not eat from any tree of the garden. Eat from any tree of the garden. And the woman said to the serpent from the fruit of the tree of the garden we may eat. Yeah, we may eat, but not the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden. God has said you shall not eat from it or touch it, lest you die. First thing, I notice that's not what God said. God did not say that.
Speaker 1:If you go back over to Genesis, chapter two, verse 16, lord God commanded a man saying from any tree of the garden you may eat freely, but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat it from it, you shall surely die. The woman said you shall not eat from it, or you shall not touch it, or lest you shall die. She added to it, she added to the commandment what are you saying, wes? No, nothing there. But it reminded me of, like just today, in religion or in other aspects, of things people add to the word of God for whatever reason they wanna add to it, for maybe selfish desires, I don't know, but they add to it. And it reminds me of even in the book of Revelation where, in what is the last chapter of Revelation, one of the last things that's ever written in Revelation chapter 22, verses 18 and 19,.
Speaker 1:Anybody who adds to the word now they'll be added to like the lake of fire, I think, is what it says all the plagues shall be added to them, right? And if anybody takes away from the word of God, then they're gonna take away from them from the tree of knowledge of good and evil in the final days. So I think about that and I'm like holy cow. It's all kind of tying together a little bit whenever I read all these things and it's strange to be able to tie it all together like that. But that's the warning. But you see that Eve does that very thing. Let me see the very thing God shall take away his part from the tree of life and from the holy city, which are written in this book, and I think it was talking about the book of Revelation there, but still it just kind of all ties back together to the knowledge of the tree of good and evil. So what are your thoughts about that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean I think you're right, and I don't know about the.
Speaker 3:I mean it's cool.
Speaker 3:You pointed out the whole whether it's touch or whether it's just eat, but I think, at the end of the day, it was just kind of in my mind just leave the tree alone, like, if that's the one thing that's off limits, then, you know, allow it to be off limits.
Speaker 3:But I mean, you see that, throughout, though, or folks are kind of always enticed by what they can't have in life, and I think it starts, you know, right here with the first two human beings, where a little temptation, a little, you know, snake in the ear can convince you to do things that you know you're not supposed to do, and I think that happened here with Eve, and so, even though, you know, let's say, it was just eat, not touch, the fact that she added to it could have even been just been more of her knowledge, knowing that it was wrong to the point that she exaggerated how wrong it was. So not even just eat, but just eat and touch, because she knew that that was really the one thing that was off limits, and so she may have exacerbated it a little bit.
Speaker 2:Do you think that's human nature too, a little bit Like right off the bat it shows, like even Eve did it in the very beginning. Like to exaggerate or sensationalize something in a story, Like if you're telling it. Do you think that's a bit of human nature to like add additional details to make it more interesting or, to you know, make a dangerous situation more dangerous, or something like that.
Speaker 3:I think it can be. I mean, folks want to tell a cool story and I know if you're a kid you ever played the game telephone like you start the person next to you. By the time it got to the end it was something completely different. Was it truly something being different passed around, or did someone take it upon themselves to kind of exaggerate the story? So yeah, I think it's possible when you hear and I even hear stories that I've heard, you know, hundreds of times, that maybe changes just a little bit or gets a little bit more dramatic than what it was the first time I heard it. And I may even tell something myself a little differently, but I don't know if I do it for any type of attention. It's just in the moment, I guess. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:I don't know. I remember this one time, whenever I was flying to Ecuador I mean, I was sailing a ship to Africa is what I was doing in the ship.
Speaker 1:And I was going over there to meet the Philippine. I don't know, I was just making that up like exaggerating a story. You don't say I'll say I don't get a lot of stories right anymore. Like my wife is just waiting in the background whenever I say a story just to be able to correct all the times I say the story wrong and it's not on purpose. She says I say it wrong. I'm telling you I'm not saying it wrong. It is right as rain in my mind, but I'm not saying it wrong. I just maybe misremember some things. So I didn't start writing stuff down a little bit more.
Speaker 1:I think my brain is full with stuff, but whenever I look at Genesis, chapter three, yes, I think that it is right here. I think maybe that they put a hedge around what the rule of God was, possibly even too, you know, just to take a little more precaution. Maybe they should have built a bigger hedge. I think of because Satan was in there. And then he said he convinces her. I say Satan's a he, the serpent convinces Eve to go ahead and take a bite of it. We don't know if it's an apple, we don't know if it's a fig, it doesn't matter, it's a fruit from the tree of knowledge of God and evil. She eats it and then her eyes are open. Then she persuades her husband to do it.
Speaker 1:Women have got a lot of tricky tricks in order to persuade their husband to do things, so I'm not sure how she did it. She told him hey, it's good for fruit, it's good to eat, it's good, all those things. It's delicious. And so he eats it. And then both their eyes are open and then they realize that they don't have any clothes on. Is that the best way to say that? I don't have to say the other they don't have any clothes on. And then they hear the word of God. Or they hear God one day coming through the garden. Now, that's weird too right. They sit, god, they hear God. He's walking through the garden. What's going on? Hey?
Speaker 2:here's rabbit hole. We'll inform you. Hold on please.
Speaker 3:So, yeah, one of the holes I went down is so the garden of Eden was kind of like a heaven and earth combined type of situation.
Speaker 3:It was the earth actually being in God's presence and so the fact that God was walking in the garden with them, it says in the evening wind.
Speaker 3:But basically the rabbit hole I went down was that the way the world was initially created in the garden of Eden is you were in the presence of God, so he was there, he was roaming, heaven and earth were kind of intertwined and then once this all took place, with the forbidden fruit being eaten, that kind of separated Adam and Eve and earth from the presence of God.
Speaker 3:And with that, in order to get back in the presence of God, is why you had things like the sacrificing of animals is basically something had to die If it wasn't you yourself. You were sacrificing an animal versus yourself as a human, and sacrificing that animal is what got you back into the presence of God. That basically Adam and Eve got us kicked out of and then, moving forward in the story, jesus became that sacrifice to open up the presence of God to us more willingly, where we didn't have to sacrifice clean animals any longer. So I think, with this and in Genesis and how the rabbit hole taught me is that the garden of Eden was technically a heaven and earth combined type of situation in the presence of God, and that's ultimately what we're looking to get back to at the end of the story, at the end of Revelation, et cetera, when we're all made whole.
Speaker 2:Well, and what was interesting in what we watched and listened to also was that it's saying you don't have to wait till you die to experience heaven, like the intent is for you to be able to experience it while you're still here on earth. So that was interesting too. You're like, oh, wait a minute. So it's kind of cool. It really was the juxtaposition of having both heaven and earth together and then having them separate, and then there's a crossover that still exists and we can actually reach that while we're still alive. And where I had frustration and Pierre will tell you is I still have this whole question about when we die and I just wanna understand that more clearly. And I'm sure that'll be on. We'll touch on that later, but what we watched didn't touch on that enough for me. But that's okay, because I still like to hear about heaven and earth.
Speaker 3:And it basically touched on Jesus being the one person, the one God, that was both. He was full human on earth and full son in heaven, and he's kind of that bridge, like I said, now, and even as he's ascended to heaven, he's left that bridge open to where his word, his teaching, is kind of the presence of God throughout this earth, currently in this world.
Speaker 1:Yeah, interesting things. It's stuff that we just don't know about. And there's even crazier stuff. I don't wanna say that your stuff is even crazy because it's hypothetical. We don't know the answers to some of these things and it's good to try and draw those conclusions, but I don't think you're crazy. Now there are crazy things out there about stuff like this that really think outside of the box. I don't know if you guys have ever heard like this reptilian conspiracy theory, right, a David Ike guy where he talks about it's kind of like a reptilian theory where that's what created reptilians are aliens and the serpent is one of those reptilian people over the words, over governments and stuff like that. Just crazy stuff, I mean because people don't know the answers to some of these things and they try to fill on the blanks.
Speaker 2:Didn't they ever show like V or something like that years ago.
Speaker 1:You're right, but this David Ike fellow has made a living off of these, off of this reptilian theory and all these stuff. But anyway, you read it and you go huh, I don't want to rule that out either, because it sounds kind of. Then I think about the serpent in the Garden of Eden and I'm going well, that's kind of a reptilian thing, isn't it? And I start thinking about what David Ike and I'm like okay, no, I can't. We can't fill in the blanks to all the questions. We don't have all the answers. There's some weird stuff that's going on that we don't even know about.
Speaker 1:You think about Jude, chapter Jude, chapter nine, jude, verse nine, where it talks about Michael the Archangel and Satan wrestling or trying to. Satan's trying to wrestle the bones of Moses from Michael the Archangel. Hold on a minute now, what are you trying to tell me? And this is from the book of truth You're trying to tell me that that really happened. Well, I'm going to take it that it did, because I believe in the Bible and I believe that this has got a pretty good, accurate account of a lot of things, and so I'm just going to have to take. I want to see them wrestle. I want to see the WWE and see what Vince McMahon does whenever that happens, right.
Speaker 3:And boy.
Speaker 1:But that's what. That's what we're told to like in Ephesians chapter six. I'm going to jump over there, Pierre, so I'm opening up my bag of chips here.
Speaker 1:Ephesians, chapter six Well, I mean, I got to flip the pages of the Bible. What do you want me to do? I can't. Just, I ain't got it all right there on my phone or anything like that. I'm old school man.
Speaker 1:Ephesians, chapter six, verse 10. Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might. Put on the full armor of God that you may be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil, for our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but it's against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of the darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in heavenly places. And you just break down those words real quick, because Paul says hold up, you put on the full armor of God, because your battle is not against these things, right, it's against the schemes of the devil, and our struggle is it against flesh and blood.
Speaker 1:Paul, you don't know me very well, because I'm actually flesh and blood. That's what I am, and my struggle is against flesh and blood. But Paul's telling me, though, your struggle is not against that, it's against things that you can't even see Darkness in this world, in heavenly places. That's where your struggle is. Now, that trips me out y'all, because that's strange. I can't see what these things are, that maybe are manipulating, that maybe moving some things around to try in what does Peter say? We see the Satan as a serpent in Genesis, chapter 3, but Peter tells us that Satan is like a roaring lion hiding behind corners. You know, right in the pounce. And so we just got all this stuff going on and we just have to be on guard for the schemes against the devil.
Speaker 3:I mean it makes sense, like I know it's kind of hard to fathom in our human minds, based off what we know, what we can see, but when you just think about all the things you're faced with, all the obstacles that come, all the valleys I got myself. I've been, I've been feeling pretty awful over the last few weeks and I can't figure out what's going on. I saw I think it was a quote from Denzel Washington, the actor that kind of talks about if you're doing wrong, the devil kind of leaves you alone. You know he's fine, he's letting you frolic If you're doing right or on the right path. That's when he attacks, that's when he's after you.
Speaker 3:And I felt like I've been in a pretty good place here lately.
Speaker 3:It's my faith and you know spiritual life and personal life and I got all of a sudden like there's been some struggles just trying to figure out what in the world is going on with my, my health and stuff over these last few weeks and I I get to thinking like maybe you know this is one of those devil attacking moments where he's found a way in a way to cause me some doubt, cause me some frustration, and you know he's on the attack and he's trying to prevent me from maybe that next step, that next path, that next purpose.
Speaker 3:And and that could be the case for so many of us you know, once, once you're on a really good path and you're trying to do right in life, it often seems that something happens that tries to get you off track. It's like why would that be? And on the flip side, when, when you're not living things right, it seems like again, it seems like things aren't going too bad. You know you're doing awful things. Maybe that's why, but it doesn't seem like necessarily you're only attack. So I don't know, it's just a hard thing to fathom, but the spirits and the powers kind of make sense Just when you think about life and kind of how things play out.
Speaker 2:Well, my best friend and I have had this conversation over many years because she's she kind of well, she was the catalyst for me to find my faith and find a deeper faith, and I appreciate that so so much. She's always just kind of been that person that was a good person for me to watch and to study and see how things really should be done, and it was kind of interesting that when she was going through some rough times it was me who was giving her the reminder that hey, don't forget, Like remember what you told me, like if Satan can't get at you this way, he's going to try to find another way. So if you've removed this obstacle now, he's got to find a different way in. And once he finds that if he can't get at you one way, he's going to try another way. And so I think it's just you know, like we've said before, putting on your armor every day and realizing that sometimes that armor isn't behind you. So you have to make sure that you know you're you're protecting yourself, because he's a sneaky one.
Speaker 1:Not only that, but I'm sure, if you and Pierre, or any time you go through any kind of struggles, whether it's health or whatever, if you've surrounded yourself with the armor of God and you've been doing the right things, I just wonder, like, are people there to reach out and help? Are people checking on you? Are you finding some love there? Are you, are you doing that kind of stuff? Are you receiving more so than being able to give?
Speaker 1:I think that's one of the most frustrating things. Whenever you are sick or whatever, you're just not able to give like you want to. That's the sign of a good Christian. That's the sign of a mature Christian is wanting to give. It's a sign of growth, just like in Mother Nature itself. That's what plants do. Plants give. You know they grow and then they give.
Speaker 1:And how many times are we talked about in a Christian faith or in a Christian walk, from a biblical perspective, as a tree or, as you know, look at how somebody grows. Or you think about Jesus's analogies of how seed was spread out there in the ground and being fertile seeds and growing and being able to give back. So I think that whenever you look at something like that, that has a lot of effect and cause an effect on our lives. I agree with Pierre. So I'm glad you're doing better. I want to say that you're going to do even better. I know I've been thinking about you, I've been praying for you and stuff like that, so I think that those things are going to be able to happen for you.
Speaker 3:Thank you, I appreciate that and it's just been like the last couple years have been just an obstacle. And so, you know, we had Michelle and her cancer battle and she had some other issues that needed some surgeries. And now it's on to me and so I'm feeling like we're like like a power couple here, like we're, we must be getting ready to do something big. And they were already in the process of doing something big. The way things have just gone and you know, I don't wish what's happened on us, on anybody, that would never be the case.
Speaker 3:But you, you get in those moments where you're like so why, why us? At times you know those questions why, why all of this? You know why, why couldn't it just be one versus three or whatever it might be? But then you start again. You start to think like who's the who's the devil going to target, and I feel like we've been in a pretty, pretty good space, even amongst the the thing that's on at us. So it kind of adds up and honestly gives me a little bit of peace of mind to think that way that maybe I'm just on a really good track and, you know, our families on a really good track and that's why all these things are happening, and just continue to have faith and push through it.
Speaker 2:Well, and everything we keep reading is like be joyful when you have these trials and tribulations so like that just keeps coming up over and over again is to be joyful that you know?
Speaker 3:you can consider it all joy. Not some consider it all joy. But you are faced with trials and I think that's that's tough for anybody, even with us. You know, taking this faith journey that's tough to consider. You know cancer joy. Consider unknown answers to health joy. Consider deaf in your family joy. But these are trials and I mean oftentimes you can look back on these situations if you survive them and speak to how much stronger those things made you. But in the moment it's tough, it's hard to be joyful.
Speaker 1:No, it is, and we don't. We don't know all the answers or anything. First Corinthians, chapter 13, verse nine it talks about that and it says that we know in part and that we prophesy in part. And you know, we all have all these things in part in this world, but one day, all of our hope, all of our love, all of our faith, all of our faith, all those things are going to come to an end. Except for faith, or sorry, except for love, get faith, hope and love. Faith, hope and love, love never fails. Love is always there. Love is going to be lasting eternally. And so where we hope these things are going to go away, they will. Those things will go away. Where we are knowledge, where we don't have complete knowledge, that's going to go away because we're going to have, we're going to have complete knowledge. But love, love is going to always be there because God has always loved us from the beginning and he's going to love us for eternity. So it's always, it's always one of those things to be able to look forward to, for sure. But I know that I don't know everything and that's why I just know in part.
Speaker 1:Hey, back to Genesis three. And, by the way, you two, you guys, are going to be built back like the $6 million couple instead of the $6 million man. It's going to be this million dollar couple. You're going to be like. The biotic man of the biotic woman is what you're going to be from a spiritual standpoint. That's what you're going to have, like all the spiritual fruit laying around you and everything, and you're just going to be able to eat from the spiritual fruit whenever you need to, and you'll be stronger and bigger and better than ever is what's going to end up Speaking to existence.
Speaker 2:Amen. And here's the thing. I think it's important that we talk about these things because you know, I know when we listen to other people or we see other people, it's easy to draw a conclusion that hey, everything's great, everything is good. And I think it's important for people to know that. You know we struggle to and you know we have to find a way to push through and to lean on our faith and to really dive even deeper and to let it grow stronger, and so it's just important for people to know that. I think.
Speaker 1:Wrapping up Genesis 3, it talks about, you know, all the punishments then that come to the woman and the serpent and the man. And God finds out, figures out all the things that have happened, and the man blames the woman, the woman blames the snake, and the snake has to answer to God first, and then God hands out punishments all the way down the line, the snake to the woman, to the man Right. And it says here that that's where Adam called his wife Eve in verse 20, because she was mother of all the living. And Lord God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. So God clothed them.
Speaker 1:You know God's the one that put garments on them, which is kind of cool. Then the Lord said behold, man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil, and now he has stretched out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat and live forever. Therefore the Lord God sent him out of the Garden of Eden to cultivate the ground from which he was taken. Never had to cultivate it before, never had to work the ground, he's just able to be a lazy teenager at the house. You know that's what man was.
Speaker 3:What did it say on 23?
Speaker 1:23. Therefore, the Lord, god, sent him out of the Garden of Eden to cultivate the ground he sent him out of the Garden of Eden sent him out of God's presence.
Speaker 3:You're just trying to drive home your yeah, it makes sense. Like we just talked about, you know that, the garden, the reason God was blowing there, is that it was, it was the presence of God was there, like heaven Was there Up until that point, but God sent them out of the Garden of Eden, sent him out of his presence. So sorry.
Speaker 1:No, no, it's good. And my question is who's the us Right? Because he said let's he become like one of us.
Speaker 3:I'm just the other heavenly figures.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean there's plurality there, like we talked about in Genesis, chapter 1, where the father, son, holy Spirit, is what we kind of. The Trinity is what we, what we say there, and so it's still that plurality thing. That theme that's kind of going through there, that's to become like one of us knowing good and evil and essentially living forever, eternally, I guess, is what it is. And so you got to kind of put an end to eternity and and that that goes to For us, like where did God come from? Who made God?
Speaker 1:It's hard for us to wrap our mind around that or our brain around that, because we are mortal figures and so we had a beginning and an end. And if God never had a beginning and an end, we can't really wrap our head around that, right? So that's, that's always tough to do and that's one of those top 10 questions everybody always asks Well, where did God come from? I don't know. But he I don't know that he necessarily came from anywhere, because I know where I came from or I know how I got here.
Speaker 1:But I had a starting point and I'm going to end up having a finishing point. So that's how I wrap that up and so I have to, I have to try, and for me I'm like, okay, well, where did God come from? Who made God? Well, god didn't have a maker Like I did, so that's that's number one. So I and then God's not gonna have an end like I do, so that's, that's gonna be a number two. So now I got to really think outside that comfortable box that I'm in, because I live in a mortal box, in a mortal shell, and it's hard for me to comprehend what that eternity is.
Speaker 1:But, that's, that's what I have to try and do and I have to try and wrestle with, and I have to try and reconcile in my mind. But I do know that this can't be all that. There is. It just it's just. It just can't. Is it that, if it was, it doesn't make any sense how we live our lives? Because if, if this, if we all deep down inside think that the world is all there is, a flesh and blood is all there is, if all I have to do is live day today, why in the world should I care about anybody else? Mm-hmm, why don't I just go and take whatever I want from wherever I want?
Speaker 1:Right Well you that I'll get punished. Right, I get punished. It was, somebody may kill you. So what if there ain't nothing? If there, if there isn't anything after the endpoint, who cares? Right, so I could just do whatever I want, but I think somewhere or something just tells us that there has got to be more than just what we see. There's got to be more than just what we feel. Otherwise there would be just no purpose in this world.
Speaker 3:I think there's some people that live that way. Unfortunately, like, even like today's, it's exciting. I just feel like just the yeah, like folks just have no hope. They feel there's nothing like the way some people treat like human lives with, you know, murder and things on those lines. That's, that's exactly what's coming from. It's those that that feel there's nothing more. So they disregard everything. They disregard, you know, others and People's lives, their feelings, their emotions.
Speaker 1:Yes, I think. Why do they try not to get caught? Why, why do? Why do they try not to get caught? Why do they try to hide things?
Speaker 2:They don't want to get punished.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's kind of the way well, that's where, that's where the whole thing is is like there's a right from wrong aspect, like we all have Morals to some extent, and so where did those morals come from? Like how do we know right from wrong? Why do we feel that something's right, something's wrong, like that all has to come from somewhere. And we talked about just creation and the fact that the way the body works, the way babies are formed, the way nature, the Sun, well, this plays out like there's, there has to be something. Things just work and operate too perfectly for it to just be all a coincidence.
Speaker 2:Yeah, in my opinion, well, and I think that's becomes really evident when You're able, like they always say, hindsight is 2020. Well, when you're able to look back, you can there. I can't even count the number of times when I thought something was just terrible and I can look back very clearly now and go Okay, I see why that had to happen and how this had to fall in place or this wouldn't have happened. And, like Pierre said, to have that just be coincidence that many times over is Too much so for me. If nothing else in my life solidifies to me my faith, it's that being able to see, look back and go Holy cow, like if that wouldn't have happened, this couldn't have happened, and so on and so on. And some of those details are so Intricate that there's no way like I or another human could have formed them that way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I could see that, totally All right. So God pushes them out of the garden, right? And? And then, because we're doing this on a, we're doing this later than normal and it's and it's after dark if I look outside my window. I'm going to read Chapter 4, verse 1. Now the man had relations with his wife, eve, and she conceived and gave birth to Cain. And she said I have Gotten a man child, with the help of the Lord and against you, gave birth to his brother, abel, and Abel was the keeper of the flocks and Cain was the tiller of the ground, and that's neat. And then I mean, like there's the first verse, there's the first verse, that's cool. Kind of see that that can't enable, can't even first ones ever from what we're told.
Speaker 2:What do you mean by that? Because you're the one that told me West that there, just because this is the story we hear, doesn't mean that there weren't other people remember that I.
Speaker 1:Do remember that I do leave that door open because, we don't ever hear of like daughters being born. And then we're Did Cain, mary, his sister, did Abel, you know, did Abel, where they get their wives from, you know that kind of stuff, you know. We started thinking about that. And then there are other women in that are introduced. There are women introduced into this and it's like where they get, where they come from, right.
Speaker 2:If you were the person Jesus, Jesus's lineage yeah, okay, that's, and that's what's important. Yes.
Speaker 1:That's what the but, that's what the Bible's telling us about. It's all leading up to Jesus, right, he? He is the crimson thread through the silver pages of your Bible.
Speaker 2:West, that was very eloquent. Thank you.
Speaker 1:I don't know how it came out that clear, but so so then you know Cain and Abel, their product brothers, you know, and they, they, they were had a little disputes here and there, I would imagine somewhere along the way. But so Cain made an offering, right, abel brought his first things of his flock, of their fat portions, and the Lord had regard for Abel and his Offering. But Cain and his offering, god didn't like it. Cain became very angry and his countenance fell. I never knew what countenance meant. Do you guys know that whenever you read the Bible Allegedly here intelligence goes up? I've read the Bible a lot, I don't know, I just think. Just think of how, how dumb I was before I started reading the Bible.
Speaker 2:But His face was downcast.
Speaker 1:Okay, well, that's wrong. It's countenance fell Because you got to look up. For me. I had to start looking up, like, what countenance meant, and I haven't changed Bibles in 25 years. It's the same Bible I've had forever. I know where things are on the pages. I've written notes in here. I'm just an old-school guy. I just don't like change. Okay so, so mine is a new American standard version. At the time I researched it, it was. It was the best version going. All right, so is it that? So I got that and it says countenance fell.
Speaker 1:Well, here's the problem with getting reading the Bible. I don't know what world countenance means. So I had to look up what countenance was and, like you said, it was face falling, it was. It was his shoulder shrugging, it was just feeling down because he didn't. He didn't do right, right. And Lord said Cain, why are you angry and why has your countenance fallen? If you do well, well not, your countenance be lifted up. And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at your door and the desire is for you. But you must master it. I Love that. You must master sin.
Speaker 1:I think about how the Bible relates some of that stuff with, with, like James or the first John, first John, how it talks about how you know people who practice sin Basically essentially get good at it. And people who practice righteousness get good at it and and it's it's it takes practice. It's not something you just roll out of bed. And if you've been sitting forever, if you've been practicing unrighteousness forever, if you've just been practicing living your own life and not having any regard for anybody else's, it's hard to break those habits Because and you've gotten good at it because you practiced it anything you practice, you get better at than what you were before. And if you've been practicing unrighteousness or sin for 30 years, let's say 16. Maybe maybe people go off the tracks at 16.
Speaker 1:I was more like eight. I was, I was practicing at eight. So when I was 28 I had been practicing for 20 years. That's a long time of practicing Artcraft. You know it's not, but I was good. I was good.
Speaker 1:I can hide it. I keep it sheltered, even from my wife. I keep. I keep whatever I wanted to away from her. She had no idea, right, or at least she'd never catch me. I've been so good and I knew how to hide that stuff. But I was trying not to be good at it anymore. Even during years of Of of, you know, being married or whatever, I was trying not to do wrong anymore. It's just I was practicing it and that's what I was used to. So it was hard to stop and and so I had to start trying to practice the righteousness part and eventually Practicing righteousness overcame practicing unrighteousness and it was harder to sin. Then it was to not sin. Does that make sense? I mean that I said that right, because because before it was easier to sin than to not sin, but whenever I kept practicing it it became easier to not sin. Oh, it became easier to, yeah, easier to not sin than to sin. So it, but it took practice.
Speaker 3:I think you see that a lot when, like, folks have been incarcerated for a long time, that's what I was gonna say. So you got someone that's been locked up in jail or prison for X amount of years and when they they get released, oftentimes they don't know how to survive or how to live out in freedom. They're so used to jail and just the routine of you know, the free meals a day or the friendships that you built in there or the bed to lay down on, like perhaps you get free and you don't have anywhere to go.
Speaker 2:Struggle to find a job.
Speaker 3:Oftentimes, you know they end up right back into jail or into prison and you're like well, is that where their comfort zone is? Is that what they're comfortable with? Is that what they were practicing? That's where they've been for X amount of years. They get out here and maybe they don't like it. Maybe they don't like their freedom. Honestly, they prefer the structure of knowing what they do have behind bars and they end up doing something to, sure enough, get themselves locked back up.
Speaker 1:Maybe they should join the army or Marines or something. Can we put them in one of those productive kind of things where they're fighting?
Speaker 3:Well, I mean, you see so many military vets like, hang on and, you know, reenlist intentionally, even once they've served their time, just because that's what they're used to. That's the you know you're putting your life on the line, but that's still their comfort zone and that's what people often revert back to when they don't know where to go, is they turn to their comfort zone. And, you know, is your comfort zone going to be the Bible? Is it going to be Jesus? Is it going to be alcohol? Is it going to be food? Is it going to be, you know, bad relationships, that comforts where people tend to turn. And, like you said, if you've been practicing the good, then you'll turn to the good. If you've been practicing the bad, you're going to likely revert back to those bad habits because that's where your comfort zone is.
Speaker 2:I think it comes back to you as humans. Even though the unknown might be better, we're more comfortable staying in the known.
Speaker 1:You're right, and from somebody who's been on both sides of that fight, I wouldn't have it any other way of being on the side of doing good. Every once in a while during my days of doing bad, I'd make somebody happy, right, but I didn't really mean to, I was accidental. Now I make people happy and I have a reputation of being kind of a dependable guy. I say that I downplay that a little bit. I'm a dependable guy. I have a reputation of being a good dude. I'll count on me, those kind of things and a man of good reputation Bar, that's priceless. That is priceless. But it took years of practice to do that, and I say years.
Speaker 1:The number one thing I ever did was surround myself with people who were good been already, you know or good people. I surrounded my family with good people, family people. I did those things so I could know how to do that stuff and that's how it rubbed off on me. That's how I learned. That's how I had to see it in play. I had to see it in action.
Speaker 1:If I had to do it by myself, going solo, resisting temptation, resisting Satan, all those things, I don't know that I could ever do it. I tried at a time or two. I tried all by myself. I just didn't have the strength, I didn't have the willpower. I needed a support group in order to help me be able to push me through those times without them even knowing that they were pushing me through there. They didn't have to push like from behind me. I was digging in my heels and not wanting to go anywhere, but I just made it. I see how their family unit worked. I saw how I thought of them and I was like man, I'd love to be that way someday. Now, I'm not a real deep thinker, so I didn't really go home at night and think, boy, I want to be like that person. I didn't think that, but I just knew that's what I wanted to be. You know, I just knew that's where I wanted to go, without even really ever thinking about it.
Speaker 2:Well, and I think that's smart because, you know, I grew up hearing all the time you know our product of your environment, so you recognized that you needed to surround yourself in a different environment to become like that, and so kudos to you, Wes.
Speaker 1:And if you don't know how to do something, what's the old saying If you don't know how to do something, surround yourself with smart people who know how to do it Right, and that's how you get there to wherever you want to go, and that's a successful businessman know how to do that kind of stuff. And so it's just one of those. And look, not kudos to me. I had lucked into it, but you guys have know me enough now that it's not really luck. God had a providential hand on me even when I was trying to learn how to drive a GMC big, big Chevy wagon or something, whatever it was. I was a van at age eight or seventh grade, whatever it was just had a protective hand on me. It just wasn't my time yet. So it's not my time All right.
Speaker 2:So one thing really quickly I thought about when you were talking is the job that I started when Pierre and I actually where Pierre and I actually ended up meeting. When I started that job, I needed to learn very quickly and I didn't know what I didn't know. I didn't know the questions to ask to gain the knowledge. So I actually ended up setting up a card table in between the desks at the end of a row between two of my coworkers who had been there the longest, just so I could absorb and hear what they were talking about, what information they were giving out, when people would come back and ask questions, or what they were talking about amongst themselves or working. And that was the quickest and easiest way for me to learn, because I had no idea what to ask. And I think what you described is along those same lines, like if you surround yourself with that, you just naturally absorb and you learn, and so I think that's important.
Speaker 1:I do too. I do too. Surround yourself with good people. Be easier to put on the armor of God.
Speaker 1:Cain told Abel his brother and it came about when they were in the field that Cain rose up against Abel, his brother and killed him. And Lord said to Cain where is Abel, your brother? And he said I don't know. Am I my brother's keeper? And God said what have you done?
Speaker 1:The voice of your brother's blood is crying to me from the ground. And now you are cursed from the ground, which has opened up its mouth to receive your brother's blood from your hand. And you cultivate the ground. It shall no longer yield its strength to you. You shall be a vagrant and a wanderer on earth. And then Cain cried out my punishment's too. Great Behold, the Lord has driven me from this day, from the face of the ground. And he goes on, and then he tries to be like a tough guy. I guess in all this. This is the way I kind of see this, pierre and Michelle, because the Lord said to him then therefore, whoever kills Cain because Cain said it'll come about, whoever finds me will kill me is what's going to end up happening. And the Lord said therefore, whoever kills Cain. Who is God talking to? From my recollection now, there's only two people left besides Cain. Right From what we know is now, it's just Adam and Eve, unless they had more offspring than we weren't told about, right.
Speaker 2:It's those other people you were talking about with. There's gotta be.
Speaker 1:There's gotta be, the Lord, said to him. Therefore, whoever kills Cain, vengeance will be taken on him seven fold, and then appointed a sign of Cain, lest anyone finding him should say to him and then goes on a little bit. So, pierre.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 1:Do you ever stay up at night wondering why you have the color skin you have?
Speaker 3:No no.
Speaker 1:For those that don't know, Pierre is a black man. Is that politically correct? I don't know what's politically correct anymore. Did I say it right?
Speaker 3:That's fine. I answered a black man. I'm not from Africa myself, so I don't speak African American, but I mean it doesn't bother me.
Speaker 1:either way, the color of Pierre's skin is darkened. Is that? I don't know.
Speaker 2:It's like milk chocolate. It's beautiful.
Speaker 1:Oh, come on, that's Michelle. Come on, this is a child's podcast, but this is one of the. I had a guy one time that I worked with and he was a reputable man, he's a very smart guy and stuff like that and he said do you know where black people came from? And I said no, I didn't know how to answer that either, because he was a black guy and he's bigger than me, so I was kind of scared of what was going to end up happening. And he said what story of Kane? I said what about it? He said the mark and then he went on to talk about it and I was like, oh okay, All right, and that was kind of cool to hear that too. Maybe that's where this first distinction came from in people's skin colors.
Speaker 3:Yeah, maybe potentially, I don't know about that.
Speaker 3:but I see what part you're talking about. But is it right? Because I know you can go back to which we're not here yet. But I know oftentimes I hear the split between Ishmael and Isaac. You know, I've heard that as well when it came to Hagar and that kind of being. You know the split when it came to race as well. But one thing that kind of jumps out here, like we listen to a lot of music and so we're talking about, you know, kane and Abel. I know there's one. There's one part of us some call it Cray, some by La Cray where he says they say don't get bitter, get better. I'm working on switching those letters.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:And that's what it felt like just with Kane, like he killed his brother out of bitterness. And I think about all the things that we kind of do out of bitterness and just how much bitterness can cause regret in the moment. And I mean, I even think of times where I've just been bitter and you know, obviously I didn't act on it, thankfully. But you know, losing losing like both parents and all those things, and you kind of witness other people either bat-mouthing their parents or talking bad about their parents.
Speaker 3:I know everyone doesn't have the same type of relationship with their parents but there can easily be bitterness. I know Michelle, you know felt it some after you know the miscarriage, where she hears people, you know, can't wait to get rid of this baby and outside smoking while being pregnant. There's a bitterness there and I think Kane definitely had that bitterness himself that his fruits that he, you know, basically brought to the Lord, weren't as fruitful as what his brother brought and he let that bitterness kind of overtake him and I think do something that he regret it and you know he's, he's cursed, he gets cursed for it. So think about the times we've got better like that. We get cursed for some of our bitterness and who knows who knows those situations.
Speaker 3:But I think it's right here in the Bible you're four chapters in and you see jealousy and bitterness right up front. If you know you're, you're flesh and blood and I think it's really a warning to not let bitterness kind of overcome you because easily they could have worked together. Abel was willing, you know, to go out to the field and help him, you know, bring those same sacrifices that he brought so he could be in favor with the Lord himself, and he let bitterness overcome. So that's, I think that's, the lesson for us all to to just be careful with bitterness, cause in those bitter moments you can. You can have a lifelong regret.
Speaker 1:And God appointed a sign on Cain, for anyone finding him should slain him. So they won't slay him. And Cain went out from the presence of the Lord and settled in the Land of Nod, east of Wheaton. And Cain had relations with his wife and she conceived and gave birth to Enic and he built a city called the name of the city Enic after the name of his son. And then he goes on to talk about the genealogy there of Cain. A little bit Enic had Mahujala, mahujala, cain father, and Mathu'sala, and Mathu'sala and Amic.
Speaker 3:Chronicles is the worst, by the way. So I started. I started Chronicles first Chronicles. Oh my goodness, I told you I struggled with the names, or the names. Oh my goodness, it has been an obstacle, sorry, sorry to interrupt but that's just. I started having flashbacks to Chronicles. I finally got out of the genealogy portion of whoo.
Speaker 1:What you? You're getting downhill now, man, you're getting downhill now. So if you're going to Chronicles, you're making it through it. But I say those names because you got books of Enics running around and stuff like that too and everything. And then you got a Laimic here, and Laimic will be mentioned later on in the Bible a couple of times and these people have different jobs, that kind of look like.
Speaker 1:Laimic took to himself two wives. The name of the one was Ada and the name of the other one was Zilla, and Ada gave birth to J-Ball and he was the father of those who dwell in tents and have livestock, and his brother's name was Jubal and he was the father of those who play the leer in pipe. And Zilla she gave birth to Tubalcain, and then I've always liked that name. I'm not going to name my son Tubalcain, but you know if Tubalcain, the forger of implements and bronze and iron, and the sister of Tubalcain was Nama, nama. And then Laimic said like if anybody kills me, let punishment be on me 10 times or whatever he says there, I don't even know 70 times, seven fold, 77 fold of what happens to Cain. So he was kind of trying to make himself bigger than Cain. You know just all that stuff. But here's the important part. Adam had relations with his wife again, not that part, I'm not talking about that.
Speaker 1:She gave birth to a son. His name was Seth. For she said God has appointed to me another offspring in place of Abel, for Cain killed him and a Seth. To him also came a son who was born, and his name was Enish. Then men began to call upon the name of the Lord. That's something right there. We get that there. Call upon the name of the Lord. Are they praying to him? Are they calling on him? I mean, I'm just gonna put it in my terminology where they make a phone call, you know they're not texting him. Probably I wouldn't think, even though maybe they did to some degree. Maybe they wrote hieroglyphics to God, I don't know what they did, but they started calling on, they started praying on them, they started singing worship, whatever it was.
Speaker 2:Mindsets to proclaim the name of the.
Speaker 1:Lord, I like mine better. I'll be honest, Michelle, as you. You're not impressing me with your Bible verse. No, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 2:It says to call on, but then it gives you like the footnote and it says or to proclaim Well, it's not even different.
Speaker 3:It says at this time, men first made use of the name of the Lord and worship.
Speaker 1:There you go and that's what it is. And why do we have all these different versions? Well, I have one that was from 20 years ago, however long it's been, and you guys got ones that are newer, and I have some that are newer. It's just, once again, these are. This is the one that I like, but this is the important part. Luke, chapter three. I say it's important, it's what I feel is important. Luke, chapter three, starting verse 23,. It's the genealogy of Jesus, again y'all, and I'm not gonna go through it, but I just wanna read the last verse here, a verse of chapter three, verse 38. Says the son of Enish, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God.
Speaker 3:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:It traces Jesus' genealogy all the way back to the son of God and it starts from what we're talking about now. And you wonder why those names are important. I'm not gonna say they're important. Important they're not a matter of life and death, they're not a part of your salvation, but they are a part of your salvation because it's a part of your history as well. If you're a believer in our Father, our brother, lord and Savior, jesus Christ, because you've been adopted into that family, you are part of that family story, which for me it's kind of cool and I hope it's kind of cool for whoever as well.
Speaker 1:But, as we talked about before, from Matthew, chapter one, that story is tainted. That story's got a lot of different things. People don't need to feel like they're unworthy to be a part of that story If you're a part of Adam's family. His family was kind of broken at some point. He didn't do everything right as a father maybe. Evidently. I mean we see him eating from the tree. We see his wife eating from the tree. We see his firstborn children having a dispute to where one killed the other.
Speaker 3:You can even argue that if that didn't happen, then Seth didn't come into play.
Speaker 1:No, you're right, and here's the part of that, pierre. I think Bible tells us God works all things together for them that love the Lord. Okay, my kids are having a dispute in the background, by the way, I apologize for that. God says the Bible says God works all things together for them that love the Lord. Don't leave off the back part of that for them that love the Lord. Adam apparently loved the Lord. Men started calling upon God's name.
Speaker 1:Then is what we read about in Genesis, chapter four. So Seth loved the Lord, those people love the Lord, and so God worked it all out to where it got, to where the point is right now, today, that we could be a part of that family. The purpose, the plan Cain wasn't going to mess up that plan. The Satan wasn't going to mess up that plan, because God has a plan and no matter how many times we stumble, we tumble, we fall, we get back up, he's going to work that plan out for good. If we continue to love him and that's the practicing part we continue to practice to love him, to let him work it out we make the next best decision.
Speaker 1:If we mess up, what's the next best decision? Well, god told Cain. God told Adam that now you're going to have to work the ground right. Told Cain, you're going to have to work the ground. Cain didn't like it, so Cain didn't make the best decision. Cain didn't make the best decision. Cain made a bad decision and he piled a bad decision on top of another bad decision on top of another bad decision right and got the family history that he has. Adam made the next best decision and he kept piling on those best decisions, even though maybe he made some wrong ones along the way. He kept loving the Lord and trying to do right and it got to Seth. And then we take off from there. That's how.
Speaker 1:I was wrapping it up, guys, that's it, that's it, that's all I got.
Speaker 3:I think you did a great job. It makes perfect sense and you see it throughout the Bible. Like people make mistakes, king David makes mistakes, but his love for the Lord doesn't falter. He turns back in. Lord is always there with open arms, willing to work things out for your good.
Speaker 1:But God that's right, we will pick up I don't know where we're going Jumping over to the New Testament made next time. Hopefully we'll have the question, the question episode between all that. That'd be so cool if we do it, and who knows, something may happen along the way where we don't have to stick to a plan. We're gonna leave room for God to be able to work things out in whatever direction he wants us to take at this podcast, because this podcast was dedicated to him to start with, and so that's why we're trying to dedicate it to him always. So that's what we're gonna do, right, guys? Amen, oh right, hey, pierre, tell everybody where they can find it again, because that was at least 30 minutes ago and I'm not gonna remember where all the finding faith, that losing sleep at gmailcom is, all that stuff is.
Speaker 3:There you go. Findingfafelosingsleep at gmailcom. If you would like to email us also on Twitter, slash ex at findingfafepod. You can find me personally on Twitter at pwe31. You can find Michelle at gopacgo411. And Mike Weck at loafinit on Twitter as well.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I appreciate you guys so very much, Not only Pierre and Michelle, but also all the listeners. We look forward to hearing the questions that you have or any kind of reviews, and you'd like to leave some kind of comments with some questions in there. We do appreciate that as well. We always love to hear from you. But, more importantly than that, you guys pray for us and we will pray for you and we'll see you guys next time.